{"version":1,"type":"rich","provider_name":"Libsyn","provider_url":"https:\/\/www.libsyn.com","height":90,"width":600,"title":"Teaching Meaning: Beyond "Just Tell Them"","description":"Drew Perkins talks with with author and educator Christian Moore to critically examine the "just tell them" model of instruction often championed by popular "science of learning" advocates. Drawing from his book, Teaching Meaning: What Works When Telling Isn't Enough, Moore introduces the framework of "enactivism"\u2014the cognitive science-based perspective that meaning cannot be simply transmitted from teacher to student, but must be actively enacted through experience. This conversation challenges the reliance on scripted, atomized curricula and argues for a "Teaching With" approach that prioritizes professional judgment, relational adaptation, and the critical role of variation in student learning. Links & Resources Mentioned In This Episode Have some feedback you\u2019d like to share? You can email me at drew@thoughtstretchers.org. If you enjoyed this episode, please share it and please leave a review on Apple Podcasts or wherever you're listening. Key Takeaways & Learning Objectives The Enactivist Framework: Understand the shift from viewing students as "storage vessels" to "active inferencers" who construct meaning through mutual, relational adaptation. Defining Instructional Stances: Distinguish between "Teaching To" (agreement-based), "Exploring With" (discovery-based), and "Teaching With" (relational adaptation), and why the latter is the most effective for deep understanding. The Role of Variation: Discover why "variety gives meaning"\u2014and how structuring lessons around key distinctions rather than isolated facts helps students make sense of complex systems. Critiquing the "Science of Learning": Explore the limitations of pre-requisite knowledge checks and rigid cognitive load strategies that can sometimes deskill teachers and reduce learning to shallow recitation. Restoring Professional Agency: Learn why experienced educators must prioritize community of practice over top-down, punitive administrative mandates to prevent the "deskilling vortex." Episode Highlights & Timecodes 00:10:02 \u2013 The Thesis of Enactivism: An introduction to Christian Moore\u2019s work and how enactivism bridges the gap between progressive discovery and traditionalist instruction. 00:13:12 \u2013 The Three Stances: Moore defines the framework of "Teaching To," "Exploring With," and "Teaching With." 00:17:01 \u2013 The Critique of "Just Tell Them": Why the "science of learning" advocacy can lead to a culture of achievement that prioritizes performance over authentic understanding. 00:36:38 \u2013 Meaning as an Enacted Process: Why teaching is a biological and relational process, not a data transmission problem. 00:45:41 \u2013 Planning for Key Distinctions: Practical strategies for lesson planning that center on distinguishing concepts rather than flat delivery of content. 01:10:45 \u2013 Premeditated vs. Relational Teaching: The danger of "atomized" lessons and why real-time, feedback-driven teaching is essential for cognitive development. 01:23:03 \u2013 Combating the "Deskilling Vortex": A critical look at how scripted curricula and high-stakes inspection cultures impact teacher retention and professional growth. ","author_name":"The ThoughtStretchers Podcast","author_url":"http:\/\/ThoughtStretchersEducationPodcast.libsyn.com\/site","html":"