{"version":1,"type":"rich","provider_name":"Libsyn","provider_url":"https:\/\/www.libsyn.com","height":90,"width":600,"title":"\ud83c\udf99\ufe0f FS81 - Abimbola Olajide - Tactile, hands on practice","description":"In today's episode, Olivia is joined by Abimbola Olajide, serial social entrepreneur and Chief of Play, to explore tactile, hands-on facilitation and what it means to work with the whole person in the room. With a background spanning community convening, grief support, and corporate consultancy, Abimbola shares how she found her way into facilitation and why embodied, kinesthetic approaches are at the heart of everything she does. They talk about: \u25cf paying close attention to embodied feeling when listening to stories \u25cf how personal experience led to founding a CIC supporting people through life transitions \u25cf her consultancy grounded in human-centred work, congruence, and her \u00e0j\u1ecd\u1e63e ("let's do it together") practice, using tools like LEGO Serious Play & modelling wax \u25cf how metaphor, play and physical materials open up focus, emotion and better decision-making, even in corporate spaces. Quote highlights "The power of metaphor, but also using tactile with that, just allows people to go from 'fine'to actually 'this is what this model is saying today'... it gets from zero to deep really quick" "A decision doesnn;t have to be 'I need all the data, and then I need to be stressed... I can play about this'. The term would be blue sky thinking, but I call it purple cloud thinking" Links Today's guest: Abimbola Olajide \u2014 In Every Season CIC ; At\u00fank\u00f2  https:\/\/atunko.co.uk\/ & https:\/\/www.linkedin.com\/in\/abimbola-olajide-67a54b63\/  Today's host: Olivia Bellas \u2014 Coach, Facilitator, Learning Experience Designer https:\/\/www.linkedin.com\/in\/oliviabellas\/ To find out more about Facilitation Stories and the IAF England & Wales Chapter: \ud83c\udfa7 https:\/\/facilitationstories.libsyn.com\/ \ud83d\udce7  podcast@iaf-ew.co.uk \ud83c\udf10https:\/\/www.iaf-world.org\/site\/chapters\/england-wales Transcript Olivia: . so welcome to facilitation stories. how do facilitators end up in the profession? What methods and techniques can we learn together and we discover it all in this community podcast, brought to you by the England and Wales chapter of the International Association of Facilitators, also known as IAF. My name is Olivia Bellas and today I'm talking with Abimbola Olajide. Abimbola is also known as the Chief of Play. She's a serial social entrepreneur, passionate about the power of tactile play, fostering human-centered connection and growth, and she uses hands-on engagement to rewire mindsets in professional and community spaces. Welcome.  Abimbola: Thank you. Thank you. Thank you for welcoming me, and I'm so glad to be here.  Olivia: Yeah. I am so looking forward to chatting today, and I know we have that focus area of the kind of tactile, the hands on practices, really looking forward to diving into all of that world. but firstly, I wanna actually just touch in on something. We'll be finding out more about you, but I wanna know today, what's making you smile in your world of facilitation. Just curious about your kind of current landscape, and then we'll get into a bit more about you.  Abimbola: Okay, so, today what's making me smile in the world of facilitation I guess the connection to self, and I know that sounds very stereotypical, but I'll, I'll explain as a facilitator. I was at a workshop last week in the London Stock Exchange and there was, This guy, Peter Ra, he was telling us about storytelling and how we capture stories and you know, methods to just tell stories at an executive level. And one thing that really struck me from what he said was, you know, when you listen to a story or when you watch something or just noticing how you feel, and just that feeling and that part, I'm holding my belly area is just above, um, as I speak, but just how you feel, how something makes you feel. And that kind of made me stop and actually feel like, actually, you know, sometimes we. Ignore feelings or put them to the side, or we'll we'll have, whether it's chest tightening or you know, a gut feeling. Those are all indicators of our body telling us something. And him just saying, that actually made me really curious. Like when I listen to things or when I hear things or when I experience things, what's that feeling that I feel? What is it? So I've been really kind of curious. And listening out for that feeling. So that's kind of making me smile. 'cause sometimes it's like, ooh. What's that?  Olivia: yeah. What's that? Kind of, either it might be there or it might not be there. Abimbola: Like, oh, what's that? I'm feeling something. Or how come I'm not feeling anything?  So that itself, both of those are learning, by the way. 'cause it's discovery. Of myself. And I think when I apply that back into the work that I do, for the most part, if I'm doing work that I'm not feeling anything about, I think that also translates to the work that you do. There will be something not as warm or not quite captivating as it could be. So yeah, just that reminder to be like, oh. What am I feeling here? So that's, what's kind of taken my attention in the last couple of weeks in the facilitation space.  Olivia: It is a great reminder, especially as facilitators, 'cause we can get drawn into so many different directions. Mm-hmm. But as you said, you know, what's the body saying about that particular moment in the room or project? Mm-hmm. And actually as you were talking, 'cause I said, oh, you know what's making you smile? And just even me smiling in reaction to what you were saying just felt really great as well. So we don't pause enough, I think. Abimbola: Yeah, yeah, yeah. We don't pause enough. We don't pause enough. Definitely. So.  Olivia: So actually was, you mentioned this particular session, The storytelling one. can we just hear a little bit more about that and what, you know, made you be at that particular moment?  Abimbola: that's a very interesting story that I'm gonna share more about, but I'll, I'll give you guys like  A bit of a sneak peek at it. So I, a friend of mine, so I'm a director in the board of another CIC called connecting stories. So they help women with financial literacy and developing themselves and their careers and also using stories to connect. So. the founder was like, oh, there's this amazing event. Let's go.  So what it was talking about was executive presence and storytelling and how you can use storytelling to, capture a lot of things. So whether it's attention or marketing or all of that. And also the, I guess the ethical part of using it for good as well. So really going into how you could use storytelling, but also helping you to, I guess, realize how it works. 'cause there is a science behind it. And that's not a bad thing. But you also then. the ethical thing for me, I think to do is use that for good, right? So to help people actually connect with stories and, you have to connect with it as well. So yeah, that's why I was there Olivia: Well, I guess the, the things you were talking about storytelling, and obviously you touched on that kind of embodiment aspect that was making you smile as well. And I think I'm really interested in how your story has evolved in terms of the nature of tactile work that you do. Mm-hmm. Very hands-on practices. Mm-hmm. Is there a kind of defining moment for you that where some of this particular work you transitioned into?  Abimbola: Um, I say there are many defining moments, so I'll tell you the story and then you can see which moments stand out for you. So I would say unofficially, I've probably been facilitating four. Maybe 15 or so years, unofficially, I didn't know it was a term, but I was always the one to facilitate spaces, to host things, to bring people together, to ask the questions, to mc, do all of those things. And then I think almost seven years ago now. I started in every season and that's the CIC that, I, run with, my team. And, it was from a season of bereavement, so grief, and I really wanted to get people's stories. So at the time in my early thirties and I was widowed and I was like, this is a. Journey to be going on. how do other people navigate this season? Surely there must be other people in the world navigating a season of grief. so I started getting introduced to different people and I would interview them. So I, the first series that I started was a podcast where people were sharing their stories of being young and widowed. And then it went on to different types of. Either bereavement or life challenges and transitions. And then six years later the what started out as a podcast and sharing stories to help and to heal has turned into a CIC where we help people and individuals transition through various life seasons. We're always going through a transition of life. For some reason or the other, and we journey with people to do that. And a lot of the time when we think journeying, sometimes that could look like talking. But for in every season, what we've actually found is that artistic practice embodied movement alternative. Kinesthetic type practices in the doing is what's helped. And that's what's helped me. That's what's helped my family. I realized a few years ago that I was more of a kinesthetic learner and I'm like, oh, so there's a. Thing for it, right? So I'm like, just let me get my hands on it. Let me touch it. Let me do it, then I'll figure it out. Right? So I didn't know that that was a thing. And then I realized that, oh, this is the way I learn and I've always been interested in art and trained in expressive arts and also Lego, a serious play and possibly a few other things. And I have a way of using creative means in order to facilitate and hold spaces. So yeah, that's how I've used that. So recently we had a movement session ahead of, mother's Day. We're having a geranium making session where we're actually exploring. the art of nurturing. So what that means. so for Mother's Day, you generally think of mothers and mothering, but not everybody is a mother, but maybe everybody has been mothered, but maybe also. Everybody has nurtured something. So it could be a person you've nurtured. It could be that you've been nurtured. It could be a business that you've nurtured. It could be a pet that you've nurtured, but there is an art to it, and it also could be yourself, like learning how to nurture yourself. So we're exploring that as we make uranium. So, I hold community spaces within every season to do that. And then on the flip side, I have 17 years worth of corporate business experience. And I, I didn't want that to go to waste. So in corporate spaces I also use similar. but different outcome driven methods to help organizations solve problems bring about innovation and align to their strategic goals. So again, using play, using tactile methods, et cetera. So when I say that there is a defining moment. I think , there's been so many in there, but I guess , the biggest one was probably the start of in every season that started the whole journey. But when I look back on my life, there's probably so many other points that have pointed in that direction. So that's why I said I've probably been facilitating for long time, a longer time than I can count.  Olivia: Yeah, that facilitation experience is fascinating, isn't it? Because as you say, it's not like a, clear moment or a clear role, it's kind of something that's been natural to you , for a while. And yeah, it seems like there's, , um, the kind of community spaces part of you in every season. Which You said kinesthetic.  Abimbola: Mm-hmm.  Olivia: Like the doing part to kind of move through any transition we might be in. And I can testify. I went to a fantastic session. Thank you so much. And I'm fascinated actually at how my experience was online. and that was, really helpful in terms of me recovering from an operation and moving through that.  Abimbola: And then there's this other aspect where you've brought your many years of kind of corporate experience into, hands on type workshops with teams with, you know, leaders in, different settings. And I wanted to ask a bit more about, some of the principles Can I find out a bit more about those?  Yeah, sure. So, in the corporate space I work with At\u00fank\u00f2. So At\u00fank\u00f2 is the name of my consultancy company. And, I'm from West Africa. My family's from West Africa and Nigeria to be precise. And the direct meaning of At\u00fank\u00f2 is to rebuild and to rewire, and that's what we help. Teams and organizations do. That's literally something I say in one of my videos like a million times. So it's just rolling off my tongue. it's true that's what we help teams and organizations do, and the, the practices that we use have developed from, I guess my, facilitation experience. my love of. Tactile and hands-on, doing practice, also Lego serious play and also expressive arts. So I feel like there is such an intersection because as you can see, I do community work. I also do corporate work. I have an expressive arts background and I also do things like Lego Serious play and other types of facilitation. And I feel that there's an intersect of that world, but what I would really say that. My work is grounded on is, I guess, human-centered principles where I lean a lot on, that empathetic and congruence. Congruence is a really big part of the work that I do. and it goes back to why that landed with me from the executive workshop, that feeling of, Hmm, how does this feel? Does this feel right? Does this feel like the right thing to do? So congruence is a really big part, a big practice that underpins everything that I do. And there's also another practice that I work with and I call it the \u00e0j\u1ecd\u1e63e practice. So \u00e0j\u1ecd\u1e63e, again in my local dialect means let's do it together. So it's a collaborative approach and I don't think. I won't say, I don't think it's a real approach. It's, it's a real approach for me and I've coined it, but it means, you know, it's something where you're journeying together and I guess it's more than just collaboration. It's more of a collective becoming, and so just journeying as you collectively come. Because even where I facilitate a space There's an outcome towards it and I'm helping whether it's teams and leaders achieve that outcome. I also learn from that as well. there is a change within me after each workshop I do. There is something that I've noticed, whether it's, I remember I was in Denmark last month and. It always just gets me, you're in a room with 180 people that you are helping to facilitate this space using Lego. And then, we've asked, okay, build, you know this, or build your tower, and then there's a silence in the room. That's silence. Just gets me each time. 'cause I just think, how are adults sitting here playing with Lego and being completely silent? Like it doesn't last long, but like there is a silence that it just always gets me like, wow. their attention is so focused on what they're doing. So, there's that part of I'm also learning. Within the work that I do and I make sure that I turn things always back to me. What have I learned from this? So I guess when I say that, I just shared practice that collective becoming and also a human centered approach based on my background in expressive arts. Trained in Lego serious play, but also that business experience and acumen that I've had over the past 17 years. And then also the empathetic community spaces that I run. It's a merge of all of those, and I think every facilitator has a work that they do or a method that they use, but also I think no space can replicate that. Everybody's uniquely themselves. So I think my approach is very unique in that way. I'm showing up as congruently as I can in that space.  Olivia: Hmm. So, \u00e0j\u1ecd\u1e63e let's do it together. And I love this kind of attention moment or this silence moment you talked about, kind of brief, but focused . With this kind of tactile hands-on work, I'm sure it doesn't land beautifully and easily and perfectly with every workshop you've ever done. what are the ways that you get to that attention silent moment? You know, it, seems like quite a challenge to achieve sometimes.  Abimbola: Yeah, I think I've been lucky that in most workshops when people get their hands on the Lego, or sometimes I use other means, so I have an called wax and bricks method where I use Lego bricks and I also use modeling wax. So it's a bit harder than Play-Doh, but it's completely moldable and it doesn't dry out and it's more natural. And what I've done in those sessions is I take sometimes. Multiple tactile things. So some people actually don't like Lego, like they don't like touching it. it's a thing and that's very Okay. So because it is something hard, I bring about something soft as well and something that they can mold and that sometimes helps. So what I sometimes do in sessions where I'm like, I don't know whether this is gonna land or, you know, I've been given a brief about some things. I can bring two alternative means.. , which then people can choose. Which they want, or they can use both, but they're choosing essentially, but we're still going through what we need to do. But they have then a say and a choice in what they want to do. I've never had anybody refuse anything. that's been good. And then when I've worked online, there's a session that I did. It was really powerful and actually it was a practitioners, counselors, psychotherapists, and. I asked them to bring something that they could build with, you know, ice, Lego, or bricks or blocks or modeling clay. And people brought clay, people brought Play-Doh, people bought marshmallows. I loved the creativity, someone brought something else, like it wasn't what you would think it would, but they were still able to build, And actually that session was quite focused on. Playing Your Way to Better Decisions, which is a program that I run, and they were able to do that, like get better decision making from that session using whatever means that they have. So essentially like.. Anything tactile is anything that you can touch.  Olivia: So that's about options. So bringing different things because not everyone, it will land that particular kind of object , and I love the marshmallows. I love the fact that people have been so creative with what they already have. So options, but also, like you say, the non-judgment and allowing for time . So. I'm just kind of jumping now to thinking about an actual workshop with you and, you mentioned that modeling wax,, you mentioned sometimes mixing it with Lego bricks, what might actually happen in a session with you? What might those different things, tactile objects, what would they mean for me in the session with you?  Abimbola: I mean, they can mean anything, right? I always say that, essentially I feel that you can facilitate with a pencil or a matchstick, right? Anything can be anything. And, there's a quote that says Nothing is. Insignificant. So everything has meaning and everything can have meaning. So depending on the direction of our workshop. So say for example, if it was a play your way to better Decisions Workshop or play Your Way to More Congruent Decisions workshop, we would be using that modeling clay to. Scope out the options that, look at the decision that we're making. Scope out the options, and then choose or not choose. 'cause not choosing is also an option, right? So we'd get to the end of the workshop where we've created and made and shared stories. And then We decide. Or the participant decides. What their choice is. And not making a choice is also a choice, which is quite an empowering choice by the way. But what it does is it playfully rewires you for decision making. 'cause it means that a decision doesn't have to be, I need all the data like this, and then I need to be stressed, and then I need to have decision and then actually. I can play about this. So yeah, we do a lot of, uh, the term would be blue sky thinking, but I call it purple cloud thinking. Right? So you could, it could be whatever it is that you want it to be your decision. You could choose to join the circus. You could choose to move to the other side of the world, like imagination is free. You can use it. So, we would option out all of these with our play materials and then we'll tell stories around it. And I guess just notice how we feel in that moment about the decision that we're. Playing with at the time. And then also it's rewiring because now we can play with that decision. We came in with the workshop with it heavy, but now we're playing with it and actually it means we can revisit it again. And it doesn't have to feel heavy because we don't have to have the final outcome. Now we don't have to make the decision, but we do know that we can play with it.  Olivia: What is it that using these tactile methods shifts in us? Abimbola: you know, I have five children there's a lot of play happening and they're at different ages. So I have a teenager and then my youngest is six. and there's a lot of play happening in our house, and I think there's something that happens to us at some point that we forget to play. as we grow up, we think actually we need to make serious decisions. Now we need to be serious in how we do things. But we forget to play. And actually play is a big part of our learning. It teaches us to create, it teaches us to fail. It teaches us how we mock things up and we are building blueprints. To make decisions while we're playing, but we don't do that enough because for the most part, we wanna get a right answer. So when we explore that through play it can bring about a lightness. Sometimes that in itself can feel overwhelming and again, it's a practice, right? You don't do a workshop and then everything changes.   And once you've built a new pathway for a decision through play, you have that pathway, right? So you can revisit it again  And the more you do it, the more pathways you're gonna build to make your decision making better. So. A lot of the fundamental work that I do with teams and organizations is that play your way to better decisions or play your way to congruent decisions. And it's building a continual and sustainable framework of play that allows you to be able to make better decisions by playing, by failing, by doing silly things. That also brings about insight as well.  Olivia: Yeah, absolutely. it's kind of very much a very, Learning lab type space that you are describing very open and for yourself, right. As well as others in the room. So, I'm interested because it does feel experimental in lots of ways, what has happened in workshop spaces that maybe haven't gone quite to plan for you or have been surprises that you've learned from? Abimbola: so when you say experimental, it's like creativity. And for me, I, I love being creative, but I also, I love creativity within a framework and a container. because I think if you're just like, be creative and be free, that doesn't give enough permission actually. 'cause it's too wide and too broad. So, for example, if you say, make something. that's so broad. If you say make something with this paper in five minutes, I have a container to put that in on framework. so I work within frameworks for the most part, and it's creating and sharing and reflecting back. So as long as I kind of stick to that framework, it always works for the most part. Right? Things that have happened within workshops. Good things. I mean, I, I was in a space where I had, not too long, but I asked people to build, what they felt like today and people ended up crying and actually having like a real emotional experience with that through what they had built. So that's always humbling actually to be able to hold a space where people feel safe enough. To do that.  Olivia: and then also it's metaphor, right? So a lot of the time. when we see people, how are you? Oh, I'm fine. You are not fine. Not really. Abimbola: you need to be able to stop and have a conversation and draw all of that out. But for the most part, we just brush over a lot of things. But when you talk about a metaphor, it's you, but sitting outside of you. And you can talk about it more clearly and direct. And then when you realize that actually it is part of me, it gets emotional, right? Because you're looking at this mirror. So I think the power of metaphor itself, whether it's tactile I think it works better with tactile because you've built something when you make that connection of how you connect to what you've built or what you've drawn it becomes quite emotional because you then go like. Super deep, real quick. it gets from zero to quick, zero to deep really quick, and you're like, how did we get here? So I think the power of metaphor, but also using tactile with that just allows people to go from, I'm fine to actually, this is what this model is saying today. Oh, this model has an aspect of me in there and this is how I feel. Actually, I resonate with that model.  Olivia: Hmm. So Yes. Yeah, that's given me shivers actually just kind of going, oh wow. Like it is that metaphor, that meaning that story coming back to the story again. But like you say, it's right in front of you, isn't it? It's, it's not an abstract. In your mind discussion? Yeah.  Abimbola: Yeah. So when things are abstract in your mind, it's one thing when you allow or release that to come out, whether you've built something or drawn something or created something, it's out there so you see it and it becomes more real. There's just something about looking at it, I guess, or feeling it, touching it and being part of that construction. Olivia: Are there more sort of, different materials that you are curious to work with or try?  Abimbola: so I did woodwork for GCSE and I am like. maybe I need to go back into woodworking. So if you see, anything, don't, be surprised. It's all tactile, like all the things you can touch. So yeah, maybe that. I just love trying different things and I. What you can do with that and the conversations that you can have with people and their introspection and reflection that you can get with people when they're doing and creating something I've always loved. Creating, even before I knew that I loved creating, I loved the process of creating more than anything. I love seeing something and in seeing what it's become, that transformation process. And I love being part of that, that's actually one of my, um, ways that I. de-stress, like it could even be cleaning at home. Like I'll start reorganizing stuff, I'll start doing stuff, and then I look at it and like, oh, that looks different to how it looked before. Oh, maybe I could do this. And that energizes me. So, I'm currently have my eye on woodworking at the moment, but, watch this space.  Olivia: Yeah, already I'm excited about like the range of wood, and it's such a beautiful natural material that I think will evoke so much in the kind of workshops you do. So, I'm kind of thinking about you know, any questions that you might have, not necessarily for me, but we like to have that kind of connection with all of our guests that we invite onto the podcast. So. We're gonna ask next, yeah. Do you have a question that you might wanna ask the next facilitator?  Abimbola: I guess, I mean, I, I like reading. I like learning, so I guess I would ask them what have they read? Recently that's left an impact on them. So I think that's universal. So it doesn't matter who you interview.  Olivia: yeah. And it's always fascinating that question. I've always scribbled down like, oh, someone's just mentioned this thing and da da da. I ha I unfortunately have lots of books on shelves that I haven't. Touched yet. What's your relationship with books Reading?  Abimbola: I love to buy books. Some of them sit on my shelf feeling unloved, but luckily, I have other readers in the house who love books too. This year I've really tried to, like, I've reordered them on my bookshelf in my reading order. You are like, you look on the book. Okay, this is what I'm reading now. Okay, then this is what I'm reading next. Okay. This is what I'm reading and my order changes and I like push other books into the queue. But I've started doing that this year. I listen to a lot of books. So when I drive long journeys, I listen to a lot of books, but I do like reading. I love reading poetry. I think poetry is something that just I, uh, clearly and probably it's probably come through. I'm a reflective person, so I like to reflect and I could, I could find one thing that resonates and I could like ruminate on it for a little bit and just let it enter So I love reading poetry. I had a book club yesterday with, some other Lego facilitators. We were looking at this really cool book called, collaborating with Your Enemies with, Adam Cam and, He was on the call as well, so we got to ask him loads of questions, which is so cool. but that, was definitely a rewire for me. Um, over the last few weeks that I've been reading the book, I, I've been savoring it, like reading little bits, but it just talks about, how you collaborate in spaces that are not your comfort zone. And for the most parts we want to exit and run away, but actually lean into that and stretch. And actually there's multiple shades of gray and there's no one right answer and there's no right way. but there is still a way that you can collaborate with somebody else while being true and congruent to yourself. so I think it's a really powerful book. It made me look at like relationships. That I've had in the past, friendships, family parenting in a different lens. 'cause I'm like, okay, right. So, I was a bit more relaxed, so my kids caught like more squash over the last few days, you know, while I'm still in the book.  Olivia: The benefits of reading particular books on those around you. Right,  Abimbola: right. So, so I love reading. I love listening to books. I don't get as much time in, in the ideal world, I just sit around reading books, but I don't have that time. But, I do read as much as I can. and I find actually that. As much as I love a book sometimes, or it's been recommended to me and I really wanna read it, if the tone and the writing is not captivating, I'm unable to read it. And that's one thing I've had to give myself permission of recently to be like, I know you wanna read this book, but it's not engaging you in the way that you'd hoped it to be, and it's okay to not read it. Whereas before I was used to like powering through and then it'll be like a year reading the same book and not getting anything from it. But yeah, it's either that or I speed read it.  Olivia: These are great tips, which, I'm sure will help many people will help me. I love the ordering. That's so simple, but I hadn't thought of it and it's a really beautiful question that we will share with our next guest and. I will do as well is, to keep our conversation going a little bit when this podcast episode does come out and when it goes up and is shared with others on LinkedIn. I will share with you a question that will have come from another guest. I don't have it with me just yet for us to sort of discuss it. However, I wanna try something which is maybe bringing it to. A kind of conversation that we might have online through chat. And that might be like a nice way to, to keep it going. Yeah,  Abimbola: absolutely. I'm curious to hear the question that will come up.  Olivia: Brilliant. Well, listen, it's been wonderful to connect with you again today. Thank you for your time, your energy, your stories. And yeah, we shall speak again soon.  Abimbola: Thank you. Thank you.  Olivia: Thanks for listening to facilitation stories brought to you by IAF England and Wales. We like to collect stories, so get in touch. If you have an idea, the contact info is at facilitationstories.com. There you can subscribe, follow like the show so you get notified of new episodes. 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